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• Pressure on Pope and promise for Pakistan

  Veröffentlicht am: 29.10.2024

  Alistair Bruce-Ball is joined by World Cup winner Lauren Winfield-Hill, the former England assistant coach Paul Farbrace and the England wicketkeeper Sam Billings. The panel discuss Ollie Pope's place in the England batting line-up following his disappointing series against Pakistan, how England can prepare better for spinning conditions and Aatif Nawaz explains what the series win means for Pakistan. And with the first ODI against West Indies beginning on Thursday, former captain Jason Hol...

  Alistair Bruce-Ball is joined by World Cup winner Lauren Winfield-Hill, the former England assistant coach Paul Farbrace and the England wicketkeeper Sam Billings. The panel discuss Ollie Pope's place in the England batting line-up following his disappointing series against Pakistan, how England can prepare better for spinning conditions and Aatif Nawaz explains what the series win means for Pakistan. And with the first ODI against West Indies beginning on Thursday, former captain Jason Holder helps look ahead to the series.00:20 - England's struggle against spin 06:23 - Ollie Pope's place under threat? 16:01 - Aatif Nawaz and the panel talk Pakistan 25:15 - West Indies' Jason Holder helps look ahead to the ODI and T20 series.

• Jonathan Agnew Special

  Veröffentlicht am: 28.10.2024

  Jonathan Agnew reflects on his 33 years as BBC Cricket Correspondent with Simon Mann. He talks about all the big stories he’s covered and some of his favourite interviews. Jonathan will still be on Test Match Special as Chief Commentator for at least another 4 years.

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  BBC sounds music radio podcasts. You're listening to the TMS podcast from BBC Radio Five Live. Hello, welcome to the test Match special podcast. I'm Simon Mann. Now the Test match in Raulpindi that England lost so decisively marked the end of an era after thirty three years. In the role it was Jonathan Agney's last as the BBC's cricket correspondent. I should emphasize, though that aggers will still be with us on test match special. As our chief commentator. For at least, at least the next four years. But he'll no longer be having to answer the phone at all hours. When there's breaking news, reporting on all the many other BBC outlets. You're listening to the TMS podcast from BBC Radio Five Live. Now it all started on the sixth of June nineteen, ninety one with England taking on West Indies at Headingley. When Ben Stokes was just a couple of days old. And it finished here in Raulpindi with Ben Stokes, captain of England. Welcome to the podcast, Agatha. Yeah, that puts it into perspective. Talk about your time as BBC's cricket correspondent. What is the role of the BBC's cricket correspondent? Because everyone hears you on test match special. So how does it differ? Well, it's definitely changed over the years. And when i took over from Christopher Martin Jenkins, there was no rolling news. There was no five live. And so, really, the correspondent had a couple of sport desks a day to fill. And he was involved. Not all the time. Christopher didn't commentate every test match on on test match special. But the majority. And so when I came in, it was more or less the start of that rolling news. More or less the start of rolling tv news five live. And that sort of thing. So therefore the role did change. It became almost like two roles. So it became that news person. If you like having to function on call. Basically all the time for some serious stories, some not quite so serious. But you had to be on the air, there were regimented sports desks. But then the other side was obviously then presenting test match special, which I didn't do to start with, because Brian Johnston was that. And then obviously he left us in early nineteen, ninety four. And so that's when basically, I started presenting test match special full time. So they started from a different place, these roles, but they kind of gradually came together fairly early on. And why are you stopping being the correspondent? That's a good question. I mean, i think from both sides. I think i have to say that having been in it for a long time is probably time for a change. Anyway, it's time for fresh legs. The game has changed enormously unlike the newer generation. I'm not motivated by Franchise Cricket. I think my generation of cricketer was brought up more on international cricket. And so i don't necessarily get a lot of entertainment out of watching matches that seem remarkably similar day after day. Except the players are wearing different colored clothes than they were a couple of weeks ago. It's great. It's great for the game. I think it's brilliant for the players that they've got an opportunity to work all year round. That's wonderful. But in terms of my own personal satisfaction out of it, I'd like commentating on t twenty cricket. It's just too much of it. It's just too much of it. And the franchises I find just rather anonymous. So that's one side of it. And the other side of it is, i don't want to abandon any more shopping trolleys in Tesco's because Joe root's got a groin strain. So you're on call the whole time as the correspondent. Let's go back to some of the stories that you've covered. This isn't about test match special. Commentating on test match special, it's about your time as correspondent. Really, the stories that Zweitausendein that you came across as time went on, what would be the first major story that you covered? Well, i think the most significant thing in my time has been South Africa. And South africa's reemergence. To world sport and cricket led the way with that. So if you think right back to battle d'Oliveira and stop the seventy two and all that. So that Glenn Eagles agreement stayed pretty much in place with a boycott of South African sport. And interestingly, people always talk about sport and politics shouldn't mix, but actually, yes, it's probably right. Zweitausendein generally that shouldn't do, but sometimes it works. And there's no doubt that that sporting boycott of South Africa did work and it brought about the end of apartheid. And cricket did lead the way. I mean, Ali Bakr has had an interesting time in charge of South Africa and cricket on the one hand is organizing rebel tours and trying his best to keep South African cricket going, which, of course, he wasn't supposed to do. And on the other hand, he was also responsible for negotiating the end of it all ÿousand. And so i got to know him very well. But i think i was doing things that these days BBC correspondent would never be able to do. I went and watched South Africa's first international matches in India. There's one day which are incredible, amazing atmosphere there when they returned to international creed. Yeah, i don't think it would send a BBC man there necessarily, but i was able to watch those games. Clive rice, captain just to be there. I watched their first test match back, which was again against India in Durban. I watched them play their first test match against West Indies, which is very significant. And of course, the world cup when they came back as well in that. So i think just politically. And there is a lot of politics involved in cricket from the old empire days. And taking the sport around the empire and around the colonies is what the Brits did back in those days and they took cricket with them. And so the legacy, therefore of what happened in those times, lives through cricket. And you can see on our tours the legacy of partition india and Pakistan. The Tamils being brought into Sri Lanka, Bangladesh. You can see it in the Caribbean. And you feel that sense of. Of what happened in those colonial days? A lot of it. I don't think people should be particularly proud of or not proud of at all to be honest. And the legacy of that does live on generally because they want to beat us. But also you do get a lot of those old colonial bits thrown back at you. I think, so i think you do have to have a bit of a political head on to do this job. But I've always enjoyed that side of it. So South Africa's readmission, you met Nelson Mandela, interviewed Nelson Mandela. I think if you want to ask me what my worst interview was. Okay, what was your worst interview? Nelson Mandela. Because disappointingly, it was, and that was ninety five, i think that's our first tour of South Africa. And we were playing in soweto, actually of all places, which was a hotbed, obviously of unrest in the apartheid days. And they had this match that the England touring team played there. And suddenly i think it was unannounced, actually suddenly his helicopter arrived. It landed on the outfield. And out got Nelson Mandela. And he was campaigning. It was election time there. So he was campaigning for the ANC. And he started to walk around this ground. It wasn't a big ground, but there were quite a lot of people there. And he was waving and doing that sort of stuff. And the great thing about the South Africans, they were delightfully naive in terms of media. They really were, they just wanted, please everybody and go back one other stage. I mean, i got to meet mother Teresa, because when they did go to india that time, I had a phone call from Chris Day, the media man, early one morning, and said, hi Jonathan, do you fancy coming down to meet Mother Teresa? I said, yeah, okay. So i got on the team bus and off we went. It wouldn't happen. Now would it not in a million years. But that was how South Africa were back in those days. And so I said to chris again, I said, look, you know, got Nelson Mandela there. I don't suppose, there's any chance of interviewing him, expecting him to say don't be silly. We said, yeah. I think if you stand there, you might be okay. So i stood there with my microphone. It wasn't live, thank God. And short enough, Nelson Mandela comes. And next thing is standing in front of you thinking, right? Okay, that's Nelson Mandela. How do you thought of the questions you're going to ask him? Because i still didn't think it was going to happen. And you know what? It's like often when you're the electronic, the radio Interviewer Ÿousand, the rest of the press are gathered around you, often behind you. And they want to get in. They want to ask their questions. But you are given the opportunity to lead the interview off. And that was this case with this. So i knew if I was any pause or any hesitation, this lot all behind would come piling in that with the end of my interview. So to say that i kept jumping the gun because he spoke so slowly, very slowly and very deliberately, zweitausendein. And so every time he did that i was kind of getting my next question. It was a mess. I've got a nice photograph, but it was not an interview. I'd want to hear again. Come on. What did you ask him? Do you remember? Well, i did ask. I think one of my more embarrassing questions was. I did ask him. Do you think that the people of sweater are pleased to see the England team here and he obviously misunderstood me? Do you think they're pleased to see me in that sort of questioning tone? I said, no, no, of course they are. I think They're probably pleased to see you, Mr. President. But it was just one of those shambolic interviews. There's sure nothing broke down and they all came bursting in behind. But I mean, things like that, who would think there's a sports correspondent? You get to interview Nelson Mandela and meet Mother Teresa. It's ridiculous. Yeah, something the theme of South Africa. Though, I mean, took a turn, didn't it with the Hansi Cronier affair? What are your memories of that? Well, my honest, memory of that was that i knew Hansi Quite well because his sister was married to an old Leicestershire teammate of ours, Gordon Parsons. And so we knew Hester pretty well. And therefore by association, yeah, I knew Hansi Quite well talked on tours and stuff. And i was actually driving up to aintree. It's again a ridiculous part of this job to do a preview program for the Grand National for Radio Four featuring a jockey whose name I can't remember the chap who played Jim McDonald off coronation street. So bizarre program heading up the M six phone goes and it's someone from the office saying, Jonathan, we've just had this report from Delhi police that Hansi Cronier has been involved in match fixing. Now the next day was more or less my fortieth birthday. And i was taking the family all the way on holiday. So with just a little bit of vested interest, I said absolute nonsense, garbage put that away did. The program went off on holiday to a place where there were no mobile phones or any access to news. And i got back and the world had gone completely mad. So i mean, the fact was, i mean that took everyone by surprise, because Hansi Cronioda seemed to be so clean. And again the sort of thing that wouldn't happen these days. I suspect. I was sent to cover his that sort of trial if you want to call it that in Cape Town, which was an extraordinary experience because i remember arriving. And it was just. There were posters all over the place. Everyone in South Africa loved Hansi Cronier. They couldn't believe it any more than we could. And so they had this extraordinary business of the trial. And i knew his dad pretty well, because I've been commentating with him. Evie Cronier is a lovely old boy and i just remember him sitting there, just shaking his head while all this stuff has come out. He had no idea really what had been going on. So how difficult was it for you to be the correspondent around a story that was so difficult for the person involved you know where they were. Clearly guilty of what they were being accused of. Well, you guys could put your hard hat on, haven't you do your job? I think I've always felt this. I'll obviously made mistakes along the way because everyone does. But i think, as long as you believe, at the time that you're being honest with yourself, and therefore. And you're also being fair to the other individual as well, obviously, but. But when it comes down to the crunch, i think you've got to be. You know, it's kind of your reputation on the line. And people have to believe you the next time. There's a story. It comes with commentating, doesn't it? When, if you are a one eyed commentator and you say here today, well, that's extraordinary. That english should be bowled out for lose seven for forty. They were playing brilliantly. And goodness knows, if you always say the truth, they say they were rubbish. At least people will believe you next time. You say actually they were really hard done by today. Or you can't be one eyed. I don't think it can with news coverage. You've got to be fair, you've got to be balanced. But you've also got to be clear in your own mind that you think you've got it, right? But then there will be times where you don't get it, right? Unfortunately, that's just life, isn't it? As a cricket man, all your life. What did you think of the King Commission and everything that came out? Well, i didn't think that they really got down to it. And there were one or two moments i did contact the prosecutor, actually, because there was one incident that i saw in that test match with the leather jacket that i wasn't very happy with involving one of the South African fielders. But Mrs. Betoya, her name, well, she wasn't really a cricket person. And i just did think there was a bit of an agenda. I did interview the fellow with the leather jacket. He was a character, but it was just a really sad story, wasn't it? And it sort of it did lift the lid on quite a lot. I mean, I do think like things with drug stories. These things have to happen in order for things to be put in place to try and prevent them happening again. And i saw a match being fixed in Sharjah, no doubt at all about it. And i think, as a result of what's happened with all of that, i think that we are now all of us who commentate will feel more empowered to say something like the Muhammad Abiyah, no balls. I think we could then allude hang on a min, what's going on here? And i did say, and now if you go to an ICC event, you'll see up on the wall, here's a contact number. And i did say, to whichever ICC chairman, it was some years ago. It would really be a good thing, surely for all of you. Because we don't know the people who are policing it at all. I don't know what their cricket knowledge is. But we are watching every ball. And we are usually former cricketers. We've got a pretty good idea. If there's something not right, that's going on, give us a number, give us something that we can text and say just look at that. And so they do now do that. Which i think is a good thing, because actually zweitausendein on that day in centurion, with the declarations and everything else and England winning that match, i was sucked in. I think we virtually all were the only people who were, not were those who who did like a flutter themselves. Jack Bannister was furious about it. Ian Botham was furious about it, because they know how these things, markets and books work. But for many of us it was one of cricket's finest moments until the lid came off. Yeah, I mean, it's incredible, isn't it? What came out afterwards, it sort of leads us on actually into that same world, because Hansi Crony's death and then Bob Walmer at the world cup in two thousand seven. I mean, that was the. That was a remarkable story, wasn't it? Because initially it was coach of Pakistan at the time and the local police investigator said, well, he'd been murdered. Yeah, well, that was. I mean, it's desperately sad, because we all knew Bob very well. And bob, of course, was involved with the South African site when Hansie Crony was captured. That's the lay very close. Yeah. Zweitausendein. So, yeah, we all knew bob very well. Bob loved to sit down and chat dinner and great conversations. I played against him for many years. Of course, when he was, he was playing for Kent. I was told by someone who i would have every right to believe. A former player, stroke commentator from that part of the world. We were in that world cup that the Pakistan team was going to take off from Kingston. The plane would land up in the north. And that inzerban will, huck and scheider Friede would be arrested. And then the plane would take off. And there is in one of my workbooks a forty second news report that i wrote seriously, yeah, yeah, I've made it minds of the police there he knows. So i wrote this piece, which fortunately was never filed and never saw the light of day, because it was nonsense. And i think it's widely accepted that Bob just had a hideous attack. And that was it. You're listening to the tms podcast from BBC Radio Five Live. Let's go back a bit. Because when you were relatively new in the job, you had a story. That was hugely a big story, really big story at the time. And it may be that lots of people listening to this. Don't know about it or don't remember it. Mike Atherton dirt in the pocket. Zweitausendein. Well, that was the first challenge, really. And i talked about the two jobs. And on the one hand, there's the commentator, the giggling, didn't quite get his logo, this stuff. But on the other hand, there is this side of being the correspondent where you do have to react to news. And that was the first time, really, i think it surprised people. It certainly surprised listeners. Yeah, maybe I was a bit too trenchant. But it's one of those really difficult situations in nineteen, ninety, two, two years before it. We had Pakistan tour, England zweitausendein. And that whole tour was dominated about ball tampering and cheating. And it was a really ugly, nasty tour. It was very hostile. And so then, two years later, you get the situation in which it appears that England are involved in doing the same sort of thing. And so what do you do again? It goes back to trying to be honest with yourself and trying to be fair. And i just looked at those pictures and i saw soil coming out of the captain's pocket and being rubbed on the ball, which is illegal. And so the difficulty for me that day or whatever days it was, was that i was asked by Rob Bonnet to go on the six o'clock television news with the pictures going and explain what was happening. And i just didn't feel i could go on there and say, well, it looks like that's happening, but actually it isn't really. Which is why I came out and said that I felt that Mike's position was untenable at the time. People disagree with me, that's absolutely fine. Zweitausendein. And perhaps i wouldn't have been quite so trenchant at the time. But I didn't feel that i could go on and defend television pictures and make yourself look a bit silly. So you became the story, well, that was deeply unpleasant and it sort of split down tabloid and broad sheet lines. I mean, i like Mike, he's a young man. He was, you know, there's nothing, nothing personal in it. And i think that's really important to make the point like with Kevin Peterson and all these things. There's never anything personal in it. He's just trying to do a job. He's trying to do an honest job. And i like mike enormously. But it did it split the press box. I don't think even the KP story actually split the press box as much as that particular one did. And it went on for years because it was divided between broadsheets who backed Michael and the tabloids who had been very trenchant against Pakistan. Particularly a couple of years before who who sort of sided more with me if you like. And that was the way. That was the way it carried on for ages, Mike. And i find now we've never really talked about it. And i often wonder how he might have covered the story now without doubt. The best writer in the business. And again, very honest, how he would have covered that story himself. I don't know. You mentioned the name Kevin Peterson. Where do we start with with Kevin? And the story is that he were in. He was. That was the most divisive time, wasn't it? I mean, that was. And everyone got involved in that. And definitely, when. Well, there was the. There were the text messages weren't there involving Andrew Strauß. That was twenty twelve. Twenty twelve. And that obviously set the seed for a really unpleasant ashes tour that followed when clearly the wheels fell off. You know, a lot of what Kevin said, picking out the IPL and stuff, it's turned out to be right. I think, perhaps he just had a bit of a sort of bull in a China shop way of doing it. But he did fall out. He did fall out with his teammates. I think there probably was a bit of a clique in that England team. I think there was Swan and Broad and Breton. And i think you can go through that clique that he talked about. And Kevin would be unlikely to be part of that group. He's a different sort of person to them. But maybe that was an unhealthy atmosphere that. That that England team should not have had. And that would have been the coach's job to have dealt with that frankly a bit like Yorkshire and the environment that there's been up there. The coach has to take responsibility for that. But the general breakdown in relations. But then particularly the reaction and particularly aimed at Alistair Cook, that i thought was completely unfair when he was eventually told by Paul Downton. That's it. You won't be pick for him the game. Because I know that Alistair would say why we got to. Why we got to sack him. Why can't we just say, Kevin, we need to sort your game out and just leave it at that. But that was the way they were going to do it. And that was that. I just thought, the way that people piled in it was kind of, I mean, social media really kicking off for them, Wasn't it? In those days. And the problem was that the views were so polarized on either one side or the other. There was no in between. And again, i go back to the point where you try. And be fair, you try and you trying so hard in this job to play that middle line. But which I tried to do, but unfortunately, dragging people from the one side to that middle point, and they don't want to go there. They didn't even want to go to the middle point. Let alone up to even thinking that what over that side might be right on that side. You've got to try and drag them to what these people a bit of what are thinking to the middle point. And they don't want to come there either. So it was, i thought just horrible. It really was. It was social media at its worst opinions. That were just deeply unpleasant, really. And calling people's character into. Into question and stuff, you know, it's just. It's unnecessary. Sport needs opinion, of course it does. But for goodness sake, i thought it went way. Way over the top, of course. Kevin had already been. He'd been England captain. And that didn't last very long either. No, that was back in two thousand, nine, wasn't it? He lost a job off the India tour. Yeah, that was all a bit odd, too. And in fact, Strauß wasn't appointed immediately. Afterwards was, he was only on the tour of the west Indies. So Kevin's one of those people, I mean, he remains one of the greatest England bats that I've ever watched. So exciting, so talented, so skilled. Gosh, i used to love watching him bat. But then there was always that side that he seemed to not get along with all of his teammates. And i've always felt that a team should be able to accommodate anybody. Zweitausendein. If you have a healthy team, environment luck accepting Geoffrey Boycott. You know, you should be able to be strong enough to accommodate. People have different views. Just different people. And i don't think that England team actually, although some of those players might shout at me for saying this. And all we did, we did, but I don't think on balance that they perhaps did their best to accommodate. Kevin, what about Alan Stanford? Talk about bizarre stories. That was that Kevin was captain. That wasn't his fault. Alan Stanford, okay, basically tried to buy the game, didn't he? Yeah, he did. And i've tried so hard in the programs, I've done on that to find some sympathy for the board at the time. Giles Clark, David Collier. To find out to think why they did this. Because certainly, Giles, i did very well. And he has a real love of cricket, a love of history of cricket, Ÿousand. And so the pure notion of winner take all is just not cricket. You don't play cricket for winner take all. So the one sympathy line that i found from it, or I believe in it, was that England had to try and do something. The IPL was starting up. They didn't want our cricketers to get involved in the IPL. Therefore they had to find something to try and replace that as a means of England's cricketers, making a wedge at a nice, big lump of money. So along comes this fella. Certainly the programs that have come up since would suggest that there wasn't enough due diligence done into the background of Alan Stanford, who'd arrived at Lord in a helicopter that looked great, looked fantastic. Except the bits on the side have been kind of glued on. I mean, it was just a rented helicopter. How were you reporting that at the time? Well, i was there because again as a sports correspondent, you are encouraged to take a view. I was totally anti. Absolutely anti. The whole thing i thought was disgusting. And so did i think virtually all the journalists that were there, we stood there at the nursery end at Lords as this thing landed and we were just couldn't believe it. It just wasn't, right. And then, of course, we went into the press conference. There where this perspex box of a million dollars or ten million or one hundred, however it was. It only had about two and six because it lined the top of it at American dollars rest was just paper Ÿousand. The whole thing was a fraud. And what was a bit sad was one of my very good friends, a guy called Mike Haysman, who i played with at Leicester for better years Australian, who actually commentates on South African telly. He was hired as stanford's media man. And i had a terrible fallout with him. Actually, we're fine now. But i just say this is awful. And of course I interviewed Stanford. He wandered over in a massive blazer. I thought if you've got so much money, why doesn't that blazer fit properly? Zweitausendein he waded over big texan. He go, Johnny. All right, Johnny. I thought I don't like being called Johnny, actually. And we got there to antigua. And of course, the whole thing just completely fell apart. And i felt very sorry for the players, because just remind everyone. Those who don't know that there were some matches played. And it was winner takes all winner takes all. Winner takes a million dollars. Was it a million dollar per player? Yes, per player. You all got a million. The problem for the England players was that they had to say yes. I mean, why would you not say yes? But then it was only when they got there the reality, the sort of horror of it arrived and they took ages to try and resolve. How do they celebrate on the telly if they win the million dollars? And all questions like that really churned them up. There was Sir Allen bouncing two or three wives and girlfriends on his knee. On stamford cam as we called it this camera used to go around the ground. And there he was waving. I remember, the game just stopped. Jimmy was bowling and Matthew Pryor keeping wicket. And they looked up at the big screen. And there were certainly Matt's girlfriend. At the time i think she was was bouncing on Alan's knee. And of course they were in a horrible position. The whole thing it was just to say it's not cricket. I read a few things over the years that just haven't been cricket. But that. That was absolutely. That was absolutely not cricket. It was. It was. And it got the final. It deserved ten overs out of twenty England lost by ten wickets. And it's the first time we had nothing. We had nothing to do on air. We were commentating. So we opened up the phone lines and it's the first. And i hope the last time that we've taken calls from England, cricket lovers all thrilled that England had lost. That's what Stanford did. And it had that inevitable story as well, the end story as well. Back in Antigua. Yes, when he couldn't fit his plane up with petrol. And i phoned Mike Hazeman, who i just mentioned about as i drove back to hotel actually that day. And i said, I hope you're all right. And Mike said I'm just sitting, watching the telly. And my whole life's just unraveling. He didn't know what was happening. Either Alan Stamper going to prison. Has it been quieter in the last ten years? I mean, there have been fewer big stories. I suppose the one in the last decade that really stands out the whole issue around Ben Stokes. And what happened in Bristol that night? That was a difficult one, wasn't it? Because when you look, we had first sight of the film. It looked awful. It's like crack. It. This fella's gonna get really nailed here. It just. It does look terrible. But they were always confident. And i had quite a good line into his camp. And they were always confident. That that would be all right. He didn't say why, but it's a great relief. Because, actually i think most of us got to know Ben Stokes much better subsequently. And actually, I know his mum very well. I got to know his parents really well. And it's very sad when jed diver his mum and people might say, well, we shouldn't be doing this. If you're trying to be impartial, his mum stayed with us. When she lives in New Zealand, come and stay with us and keep out the way of Ben and stuff. So i do know Ben pretty well and he's a softie, really. I mean, you see the tattoos and the massive such a zweitausendein an immense Trainer. But she's a bereavement counsellor. And so there is that very soft centre to ben. And so i'm glad that he came through that. And as it turned out, he was actually doing something that those two lads would say was coming to their rescue. Which sounds much more like the Ben stokes that we know rather than the one who's having some brainless fight outside a nightclub, which is how it was portrayed at the start. What's the dafter story you've covered over the years? Dafter story would no doubt be. This crazy situation in Australia. My first year cricket correspondent, actually, for the today's newspaper, it's before this. But as cricket correspondent, and we played in those days, used to go up country the wonderful tours. We went to Geraldton up, West Australian coast, to follow the game England playing against the country eleven. And there was this. It was a story about the locusts. And we drove up actually when we. When we got there, we looked at the front radiator grille of our car and it was just smothered in locusts. It's horrible. They were big things, aren't they? It wasn't very nice. So this game happened and i remember this. I'll never forget. His name Bowler called miles Obst took a load of wikis. I got five foot, he was a seamer. And we interviewed him after the match. And it turned out that his crop was just being ravaged by locusts. While he was bowling England out. He didn't. Oh man. As long as i got wicked against the poms, you know, I don't mind his farm's destroyed. But he's got. He's got wickets against the poms. So miles was happy. But as we drove back, a story started break. Because, of course, there's going to be a test match at the wacker. And this plague of locusts was coming down west Australia down towards Perth. And this story was actually covered. And i don't ever know if it's wind up or not. But the authorities really were considering painting the whacker Ÿousand outfield blue. So the locusts would just swarm over it, because obviously they settle on green. And so i think, painting the whole whack of blue for a test match was one of the most ridiculous stories it ever happened. Of course it wasn't April. The first was it. It could have been. They couldn't it? Okay, i guess that's a look back at your time as correspondent. So what about the future then? You're just reiterate. You are. You are giving up being correspondent, but you are staying as test. I mean, it's main commentator. It's been taken a bit the wrong way. I mean, I'm just stepping back as correspondent. So the day to day stuff, I'm handing the baton over. Stephan and Henry were doing that. And they'll do it really well. Stephen Sherwood and Henry Moran. Henry Moran, young legs. I think it is time for energy into that job. But i think the important thing. And i hope that most people are pleased to hear that. I mean, I'm not. My test match special role doesn't change at all. I'll still present that program. And that's. That means the world to me. I've been a sort of a bridge from old test match special with Brian and Fred Truman and Trevor Bailey. And that lot and the way they did it to the newer test match special. And you've been part of that bridge as well, Simon, you know, you look back at photographs. And i loved working. But, I mean, Brian Johnson was just, you know, such a wonderful broadcaster. And i know, if I hadn't worked with him, i don't think i'd be kind of. Kind of broadcaster that i am, you know, he sort of gave me the confidence and the wings. If you like to be that sort of character. But you'd look back at the photos we had of those days and there'd be like half a dozen late middle aged white blokes. And that would be it. And test match special has changed enormously. Since then, i think it gets more newsy in the intervals. We try and lead the way with cricket news view for the boundary, which, of course, i love doing. But you know, you've got so many more backgrounds and voices, sexes, everything on test match special now. Which is a much more accurate reflection of what we all want cricket to be. And i think cricket is moving positively in that direction. I think we've always had a strong female audience. We know that from when we first went on radio four. And they complained that we were interrupting women's hour. And by the end of the summer, they said, ash, i really quite like this program. Here's a cake. So it's always been a strong female following. But if TMS reflects what we want, that sport to be and get involved in cricket just in some way, even if it is only listening to tms, you haven't got to be a player or umpire or scorer or whatever. Just somebody who wants to get involved in cricket. Then that's, i think, a really important part of what we do. Jonathan, congratulations on your thirty three years as BBC's Creed correspondent. And good luck on your non retirement. Very much. This is the tms podcast from BBC Radio Five live close.